Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Noodlebug » Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:58 pm

iankay wrote:http://www.ianjameskay.me.uk/KickOff2_WC2018.xlsx has results for World Cups 2018, 2017, and 2015.

I can have a go using the last four (or five) world cups only, if someone can point me at the results from 2016 (and 2014)?


You're a regular Rumpelstiltskin Mr Kay, I just have to say your name and up you pop with a magic bag of statistics!

I was going to say just scroll through the tournament forums till you get to WC2016 but I just had a look and all the images with the precious results on them in Gianni's post are broken!! Let's try the Rumpelstiltskin trick again - Gianni! Gianni! Gianni!

It's a little more faffy but (and I've checked) you can still get the WC2016, and indeed ALL earlier WC results off the online Statistics Institute in the other pinned thread in this sub-forum (the one you don't need to install). The thing is a data mine. If only it were still being updated :(

I'm excited by what you're putting together here! You seem to be making a niche for yourself as the new World Cup Archivist. Can you keep track of other tournament results too or is that asking too much?
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Freshmaker » Thu Sep 26, 2019 4:10 pm

Anything that places me above losers like Rodolfo and Sandro makes sense to me.
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Torchiador » Thu Sep 26, 2019 5:27 pm

What is that Fabio over me??? There is some some flaw in the calculation then!
Kidding aside I’m sure we will not lose our past, Alkis will arrange something to sort it out everything, he needs a little time to make it. Whatever will be the solution.
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Rodolfo » Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:52 pm

Freshmaker wrote:Anything that places me above losers like Rodolfo and Sandro makes sense to me.


Hey, I have feelings!

:lol:
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby iankay » Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:23 pm

Rankings have no feelings!

So, I made a good start, I made a mistake in the Gold Group B formulas. Corrected ranking points here, and I've uploaded the corrected spreadsheet.

But I think my rules need changing - I think I will instead award decreasing bonus points for reaching the top 8, 16, 24, 32, and reduce the multipliers giving points in the knockout rounds.

I am happy to slowly keep adding tournaments to my spreadsheet.
I have now looked at the KOASI page which is superb, and goes far beyond anything I would do, both in complexity and in presentation. I would still rather only use World Cup Finals results for rankings; I have taken a copy of WC 2016.
I can't go over 5MB on my domain http://www.ianjameskay.me.uk though, so at some point I will need somewhere else to store the spreadsheet.

9,405 1 Fabio Fichera
7,671 2 Gianni Torchio
6,667 3 Thor Skaug
5,973 4 Andy Gregoris
4,748 5 Oliver Stender
4,129 6 Christopher Durrans
2,863 7 Jacob Kofoed
2,068 8 Lee Whiting
3,442 9 Steve Ellesmore
3,174 10 Simon K
3,081 11 Marco de Iaco
2,076 12 Alessandro V
3,332 13 Frank Fuhrmann
2,855 14 Steve Camber
2,015 15 Nikos Andreou
1,433 16 Robert Swift
3,596 17 Lorenzo Lozito
2,967 18 Jørn Meinertz
2,900 19 Mark Williams
2,288 20 Rodolfo Martín
1,948 21 Sandro Torchio
2,444 22 Mick Creevy
2,112 23 Paolo Sotgui
1,465 24 Ian Kay
1,987 25 Garry Currier
1,560 26 Michael G
1,390 27 Peter Klimaschefski
991 28 Stephen Derry
1,116 29 Cornelius Henze
773 30 John Vella
1,187 31 Michele Lorenzetti
588 32 Stephen Baker
1,155 33 Jaume Perelló
1,436 34 Mark Vella
-68 35 Hannes Badrnya
262 Jörg Panhorst
-53 Peter Sommer
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Steve Camber » Fri Sep 27, 2019 8:00 am

8 Lee Whiting

14 Steve Camber

I'm never going to hear the end of this!
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Torchiador » Fri Sep 27, 2019 9:19 am

This problem comes as side effect of the friendly format the KOA uses for the players. Everyone play more ore less the same number of games of anybody else.
This is driven by the play out phase.
I mean: in real fifa tournament, if you are out of the competition, you are out. No more games. so you can’t gain points after your disqualification .
In KOA tournaments instead the player who are out of the WC (top 16) continue to gain points in the following stages.
So for example the player who reach the 16 position ALWAYS gets less point than the player that wins the silver cup (17 position) just because the player who reached the top 16 group keep on losing the whole Sunday instead the player who didn’t get the top 16 group keep on winning on Sunday.
In theory the World Cup ranking should respect somehow the final standing.
But on the other side we could not Forget about all the matches of the play out. They are history and such games must be recorded and ranked. As these games are also the the record of each player. Hopefully to see all of them in the KOASI or whatever it will be once Alkis decide to keep it up to date or to pass the hand to some trusted person (Ian K) willing to continue the dirty and tiring job.
For what I concern, I know the winner of the tournament gets an extra bonus and this is proportional to the number of the attendees. I think we could adopt a top 16 bonus but I think this should be retroactive and applicable just to World Cup class tournaments. In this way I think we would give continuity to the ranking without to distort the ranking and the koasi itself.
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Lee W » Fri Sep 27, 2019 11:06 am

Steve Camber wrote:8 Lee Whiting

14 Steve Camber

I'm never going to hear the end of this!


true
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Rodolfo » Fri Sep 27, 2019 1:45 pm

I am with Gianni on this. Even in the WC, for best attack and best defence awards we should not count the results once the player is out.
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Freshmaker » Fri Sep 27, 2019 3:36 pm

Rodolfo wrote:
Freshmaker wrote:Anything that places me above losers like Rodolfo and Sandro makes sense to me.


Hey, I have feelings!

:lol:


Funny, so do I. :mrgreen:
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby Lee W » Sat Sep 28, 2019 9:59 am

i think discounting the results of the rest of the matches would be a bit harsh and probably a lot more complicated.

i quite like the idea of top 4 getting x4 points, top 8 x3, top 16 x2... silver cup winner x1.5 or something along those lines
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby iankay » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:30 pm

OK, here's a new approach. No change to 100 points for a win and +1 for each goal difference. No change to scaling up group points: if you only play seven games in your group while others play nine, your points are scaled up by 9/7, which means that no matter how many people in a group, they always average 450 ranking points.

What is different is I've removed the multipliers: if you win a Gold or Silver Group game you now only get 100 points, the same as any game. (Winning a knockout tie still gives you 200 points, as it involves two games.)

To replace the multipliers, you get a bonuses. The theory is, if you lose a quarter final, and win the next two, you should not be better off than if you won the quarter final, and lost the next two. So, you get 200 for winning a quarter final. Similarly, if you go into the Bronze Group and win all your games, you should not be better off than if you go into the Silver Group and lose all your games. So, you get 900 for reaching the Silver Group. By the same logic you get 600 more if you finish in the top half of the Silver Group; 1500 more for reaching the Gold Group; and 600 more if you finish in the top half of the Gold Group. Which means the Gold Quarter Final winners all get a 900+600+1500+600+200=3800 bonus.

That gives these Ranking Points for World Cup 2018:
6,282 1 Fabio Fichera
6,020 2 Gianni Torchio
6,006 3 Thor Skaug
5,818 4 Andy Gregoris
5,144 5 Oliver Stender
5,197 6 Christopher Durrans
4,790 7 Jacob Kofoed
4,732 8 Lee Whiting
4,577 9 Steve Ellesmore
4,375 10 Simon K
4,351 11 Marco de Iaco
4,248 12 Alessandro Verrani
4,269 13 Frank Fuhrmann
4,284 14 Steve Camber
3,941 15 Nikos Andreou
3,696 16 Robert Swift
3,068 17 Lorenzo Lozito
2,892 18 Jørn Meinertz
3,169 19 Mark Williams
2,826 20 Rodolfo Martín
2,809 21 Sandro Torchio
3,014 22 Mick Creevy
2,709 23 Paolo Sotgui
2,463 24 Ian Kay
2,289 25 Garry Currier
1,997 26 Michael Gebler
1,204 27 Peter Klimaschefski
991 28 Stephen Derry
1,541 29 Cornelius Henze
605 30 John Vella
1,633 31 Michele Lorenzetti
600 32 Stephen Baker
549 33 Jaume Perelló
796 34 Mark Vella
-94 35 Hannes Badrnya
262 36 Jörg Panhorst
-53 37 Peter Sommer

I have just thought of a problem though. What if there are 32 entrants or less? Does everyone get +900 for avoiding the Bronze Group, when we don't even have one? To solve that problem, I could scale the ranking points so that in every tournament, top is always 5000 and bottom is always 0.
Last edited by iankay on Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kick Off 2 World Rankings | February 2017

Postby iankay » Fri Oct 18, 2019 9:45 am

So here are the ranking points with the scale applied:
5,000 1 Fabio Fichera
4,794 2 Gianni Torchio
4,783 3 Thor Skaug
4,636 4 Andy Gregoris
4,107 5 Oliver Stender
4,149 6 Christopher Durrans
3,830 7 Jacob Kofoed
3,784 8 Lee Whiting
3,663 9 Steve Ellesmore
3,504 10 Simon K
3,485 11 Marco de Iaco
3,405 12 Alessandro Verrani
3,421 13 Frank Fuhrmann
3,433 14 Steve Camber
3,164 15 Nikos Andreou
2,972 16 Robert Swift
2,480 17 Lorenzo Lozito
2,341 18 Jørn Meinertz
2,558 19 Mark Williams
2,290 20 Rodolfo Martín
2,277 21 Sandro Torchio
2,437 22 Mick Creevy
2,198 23 Paolo Sotgui
2,005 24 Ian Kay
1,869 25 Garry Currier
1,640 26 Michael Gebler
1,018 27 Peter Klimaschefski
850 28 Stephen Derry
1,282 29 Cornelius Henze
548 30 John Vella
1,354 31 Michele Lorenzetti
544 32 Stephen Baker
504 33 Jaume Perelló
698 34 Mark Vella
0 35 Hannes Badrnya
279 36 Jörg Panhorst
32 37 Peter Sommer

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